Driving Disruption: HONK Rewrote the Roadside Assistance Playbook

welcome to the know your ship podcast presented by ehub I’m your
host Frank Dolce we could do a whole podcast by the way on hockey if you want
we should wait why wouldn’t we is that your thing well your listen it is my
thing but your listeners might you know tune out after a couple minutes I
don’t know we did a uh we did a podcast a couple weeks ago on the Utah BYU
rivalry which is not involved in shipping at all well well you you’re the
host so you take this wherever you want to go but we’re going to go um yeah I
I it’s it’s my thing and um you know I went to a preseason game and it was
just despicable the production value that was displayed during that and so I
wrote them a several page essay no you didn’t about what kind of Lights the
fact that you don’t sing the national anthem from like the LGE section like
national anthems are sung on the ice you know you don’t just have a DJ
playing in between you’ve got to have chants that become um ingrained in the
fan base and I went last night and either they knew what they were doing or
they read my essay and really took it to heart and changed the production
value because it it wasn’t spectacular but it was really good and I’m I’ve
I’ve you know been to a lot of AR Aras like when you go to Vegas or Los Angeles
or Madison Square Garden like those people know how to do things outside of
the product on the ice and Utah’s got to get there so they’re they’re on
their way I think that now we’ve been recording the whole time correct okay I
want to make sure that we keep that piece in the recording because I think
that’s the perfect place to start great like this is you this by the way Matt
bour honk Technologies and it’s a fascinating company you’re the COO but what
you just described I feel like that’s exactly what a COO would do when he
goes and sees and watches an event precisely he would write a two-page essay
and by the way I noticed those things that was my first experience with Utah
hockey yeah and I noticed those things I saw where the young lady was singing
the national an Anthem present right right outside of the ice with the flags
and everything else uh the bear yeah yeah okay we can talk about the bear as
the Jazz Bear is also the mascot for the I’m just that I I think I’m might I
could write a two-page essay on on doing a different mascot but but the bear
was around the arena and he had the little drum and he was trying to get the
chance going and there were ele production elements that I think can be
improved but it looked like they had some reason behind all of the stuff that
they were doing yeah I think they have the basics and um you know by the way
I’m also noticing a trend after reading the news about the first game
regarding the levels of alcohol consumption did you read any of those articles
no um they sold more beer at the first game of the Utah Hockey Club in the
history of the delta Center than than any time in the history of the Delta
Center and um you know I think it’s maybe attributed to um bringing in a new
like a slightly different kind of fan base that really wants to go there and
what I’ve noticed is um I don’t know if you saw it last night but on the
camera there’s lots of people chugging all the time did you see that every
time they put and then and then they did it on kids who were who were
chugging those right frazzled drever yes but yeah there’s a and I’m noticing
this trend and I don’t know if it’s good or bad but I can see it becoming a
Utah Hockey Club thing where if the camera goes on you that’s the new mandate
you’re chugging something yeah which is real fraternity is which is you know
not probably where they want to go but they got to be careful not to like go
down that road too far but anyway they’re they’re getting better at the
production value and it’s it’s exciting I love having a a hockey team here
like the more professional sports that come to this area I would love a major
league baseball team um so I’m a I’m a sports fan and I think it’d be great
for the city I think so too and and it was it really was a great experience
but but we were just talking about you you grew up or or maybe not grew up
but you are you call yourself a hockey guy yeah did you grow up playing the
sport or just being Eng okay so you grew up playing the I did I did I grew up
in um Southern Connecticut where I played and my family moved to Toronto when
I was pretty young and of course that’s the mecca of You Youth Hockey and all
of hockey not to get off track but are the Maple Leafs going to win a Stanley
Cup it’s like aren’t they always one of the most talented teams they are in
yeah what for not being a hockey guy how do you know so much about hockey
well I’m not I’m not a hockey guy but I like hockey so I kind of loosely
follow along yeah you you really you know your stuff they’re perennial
perennially good M but not and and they’ if you don’t not have a premier
goenda last night Utah is lacking a premier goal tender and for as much as I
love those two guys they they just don’t have it and in fact switched yeah
goldendiamond England where I went to high school and as you can imagine
hockey ice talk in the 1990s in the United Kingdom was non-existent pretty
much non-existent so I had to take a break I did eventually play back in
college again in Vermont and uh but that was the end of the career you know
if you if you miss those those four years that’s pretty pivotal in terms of
making it to the NHL so so that that the dreams were squashed there but
nevertheless it’s it’s been a good ride since and um yeah I I I grew up playing
it’s a great sport it’s a fantastic Sport and by the way there are two things
there’s nothing like playoff hockey like and and I’m I’m you know I’m talking
about college football bowl games and you know playoffs in the NFL and Major
League Baseball and ml like all of the other leagues the World Cup the World
Cup comes up a lot people love that right but nothing seems to match the
intensity of playoff hockey and it’s a noticeable difference like you’re
watching the game last night it’s good it’s physical it’s good had a couple
fights right playoff hockey is a different animal absolutely like you you
couldn’t have said it better I love I when all sports come to their Pinnacle
right at the end of the season in one way or another it gets exciting but there
is nothing four rounds best of seven series you get to watch every night for
two and a half three months of the most intense most physical it’s it’s it’s
extraordinary I I couldn’t agree with you more the other great thing about
hockey is the way you you finish a game with a tie and you go into sudden
death it’s great for the fans it’s so good yeah it’s so good I love it okay
yeah well I think that’s fascinating what about why did you move around so
much your family was Connecticut which part of Connecticut Southern
Connecticut Southern Connecticut yeah just outside of New York okay and then
Toronto yeah my dad’s business moved us around and it was great you know I I
some people stay where they are their whole lives other people get to move
around there’s there’s pros and cons but you know the benefits for me was
just diversity right of of Toronto is a very div City London is
extraordinarily diverse and the more you can I think expose your kids thanks
go to my parents and and hopefully I’ll try to expose my kids to cultures
different ethnicities different religions different belief systems you know
it’s just it it creates a more you know empathetic understanding of what
people go through in the world in in different social classes um you know different
countries and and and so I’m I’m quite grateful that I got that and it was
just lucky you know I just was along for the ride but but um but and
especially in the business that I’m in now where we we are a nationwide
business dealing with customers on the side of the road of all shapes Siz
Stripes uh we’re dealing with a service provider Network that you know just
works their tailes off every day to help people you know in sticky situations
and having the empathy to understand what those people are going through what
those service providers go through on a day-to-day basis real life
emergencies in a lot of cases and and very risky situations um just having
that appreciation for those people and and empathy I think is really
important well well especially not maybe not especially but in Utah it’s it’s
it’s a great place it’s a great place to grow up it’s a great place to live
and you know you don’t necessarily want to leave you get kind of stuck in
your bubble but there’s real value in you know spreading your wings and
getting out to see all of the other things that are happening uh through
throughout your community and other communities and with that in mind you you
ended up uh from from London you ended up coming back to the States and going
to college at Middlebury that’s right correct that’s funny because I have a
nephew at Middlebury yeah you play soccer out there awesome yeah so anyway
tell me about that experience small liberal arts college yes um you know I
had family members who had gone there and so um it it was a it was a great
experience but but in kind of what you’re talking about with Utah Right
Vermont and and Rural Vermont is similar right in that if you let yourself be
uh in that bubble for too long um you know your your worldview can get a
little bit maybe um insular and so um you know it was a great experience um I
joined a bluegrass band in college I played the ban Joo I see that on all of
your stuff that that’s one of the things that you list I play the Pand yeah
just it’s one of those things like um you you know you try to um embrace all
the weird parts of my life that um I still think I still find some value in
and um so you know played hockey there played a lot of bluegrass music and um
made great friends that I’m in touch with today so it a great experience yeah
and then and then from middleberry all the way across the country to the West
Coast yes although there was a stop in between and that was Utah before
before you ended up at Stanford and what okay I didn’t know about that right
so I I um coming out of college I loved hockey and so I said I want to go
work for the New York Rangers and there are no jobs you don’t just you know
knock on the door and say I’d like to work here these these teams have staffs
of 10 15 it’s not a big they’re not big organizations and um and and it’s
more about who you know in in those sure situations and I didn’t know really
any anyone but there were two people on that team by the name of Wayne
Gretzky and Mark Messier who if you know if you’ve got some familiarity with
hockey anything about hockey they’re they’re on Mount Rushmore right and so I
made my way into that organization one way or the other to try to be adjacent
let’s put it to those guys you know I’d be in the locker room walking around
and just watching those guys right and then I’d watch them train every
morning and play every night and nothing better just a great experience so
long story short that didn’t last too long the um the the I I wanted to do
more than than than just that and so anyway I joined a company that was
working on the Olympic Games oh and that brought me out here in 2000 because
as everyone well I’m sure your your audience is wider than Utah but but Utah
obviously was the host in in 2002 and so I worked on on that for a while got
the the absolute privilege of living in Park City for those two years working
down here so I commuted down here to work every day and that that drive down
the canyon is is stunning you know and so very fortunate and and um work was
that’s where I fell in love with Utah and and but but as you said from there
moved on to California um to do a little bit more school and and then um you
know obviously it’s been a little bit of a ride between now and 25 years
since I first lived in Utah to now coming back with a family and and it’s
been just an absolute you know tremendous experience let me ask you before we
get onto honk Technologies which is a great company uh tell me about tell me
about your experience in paloalto and how meaningful that has been for your
career yeah it’s I didn’t really know much about it I I just knew that that
you know going to school there would be you know a privilege and and and so I
I moved there and it really the entrepreneurial DNA of that area is thick mhm
you know you can’t walk downtown without and this was a while ago I’m not
positive the vibe today I I imagine it’s similar but you know you can’t walk
downtown without just the buzz of ideas going on around different companies
different concepts and and of course the the the courses that you’re able to
take there really lean into that and and and instill that little bug in you
of boy you know think creatively and and and really try to change the world
in a positive way and so it it it got into me and um and you know pretty much
set me on the career coming out of uh that experience and and did you feel
like that was you were kind of in that realm of wanting to be an entrepreneur
like that’s okay yes we we had h a podcast guest uh recently named Scott
Huntsman who he’s an he’s an amazing guy’s he’s built a couple different
companies and exited a couple different companies on a third one right now
but he just said if I mean his advice was if you could spend a couple years
on Wall Street and understanding Finance yeah like that would make that could
make all the difference in your career but you found yourself in a similar
not necessarily Finance but a similar kind of atmosphere where the everything
was ever present the was ever present and that’s got to be I mean you you
probably still lean on that today maybe even the relationships you made back
then you you may lean on those today for sure it’s it’s intoxicating and um
you know it’s funny when you look back on your career um and I’m sure it’s
the same for you and most people which is you know being able to draw those
lines backwards to say well I got into this company because of that person
and I only knew that person because of that sale I made in the pre in that
previous you know organization and it’s really you know it’s fun to draw
those that that line that historical thread through your career to understand
how people got to where they they did and and even with with honk um I I had
started a company prior to honk uh and someone said you really should um try
to hire this guy Corey for for for my previous company and so I called him up
on the phone and he said oh yeah I’m working on something similar we should
talk about this and you know I said well come on join us and he said I’m
thinking I might actually pivot to a new idea the new idea was honk and so I
hung up and I said great good luck with that and then you know not N9 months
later I was with a friend who said you know you should talk to Corey have you
ever met him and he started this really cool company called honk and you know
the IDE he explained the idea to me and I said I know Corey I should shut
down what I’m doing right now and and join him in launching this new business
because um we were just he he he was in the kind of idea phase and and he and
I joined up with a guy named Rick and and we we launched it and and we’re
still kind of pressing on here 10 years in from from that that day yeah well
the the importance of uh relationships and maintaining relationships and
spreading your network critical critical for for business and and outside of
business success yes so let’s talk about let’s talk about honk uh I’ve done a
little research you and I have talked a little bit about it but give us the
30,000 foot what is honk Technologies yeah so honk is a technology platform
that um that operates in the um Automotive Logistics space and that includes
Towing and roadside assistance transport Salvage warranty and and many other
areas it’s a it’s a pretty big industry and essentially we um we work with
Enterprises and small mediumsized businesses who need to move vehicles
between point a and point B and uh and of course the way we started was um
the easy description was Uber for tow trucks it was 2014 Uber and Lyft were
about a year maybe two years old I can’t remember exactly but they were just
starting to become fairly ubiquitous and we said uh well Corey really um you
know had an experience with his wife where she it’s a good story she broke
down on the the 405 in Los Angeles and within a few clicks he was had arrived
on scene in an Uber to help her but then once on scene sitting in the car
with her it was like okay who are we going to call how long is this going to
take this is and you we’ve all had that experience I know I’m sure you’ve
broken down and the first thing you think about is a swear word that I’m not
going to say on on online here maybe use that in the hockey but but we’ve all
had that that emotion right it’s and it’s just so so Corey you know had this
Epiphany that it could be a lot better and and so we as I say he and I and
Rick got together and we built the platform and uh it took off right away and
so that was a business to Consumer play at the beginning okay so let let me
just clarify that because it’s become much larger than that right so in the
in the beginning was it an app that just I would use in the individual would
say oh my gosh I’m broken down I’m on Honk now I can arrange okay exactly you
pay for it when you need it yeah the incumbent in the space was triaa yeah as
as everyone is is aware and you know we just looked at their business and
their model um you know and said this is a pretty they’ve been around a while
to be generous and um you know we we think there’s an opportunity to to do
something that younger Generations will gravitate towards as in terms of I’m
just going to pay for this if I happen to need it right rather than you know
pay $100 a year in insurance basically to have that that peace of mind you
still have the peace of mind but it’s sitting in your phone yes um and and
our our big value proposition was doing it better how could we get there CU
there’s two things that matter in this in in that World Towing and roadside
it’s how quickly do you get there and how professional is the service
provider who arrives and so if we could do both of those better then we
thought we’d have a a winning recipe and we really did we there’s a lot of
reasons why we think we believe we we do it better which you know we may or
may not get into but but ultimately to answer your question yes originally it
was a business to Consumer pull out your phone pay for it when you need it
and by the way people can still do that today they can download honk from the
App Store it’s free and you pay for it when you need it and and and as you
said that’s not the the sole focus of our business the business has taken off
since that point but but that that piece of our business still exists well
that’s good to know I’m going to download I’ll download the app I I am I
thought that the consumer portion had gone away but that’s great to know
that’s great to know okay so what in your evolution made you decide to Pivot
to the direction you’re in today yeah great question uh we were you know
Rolling Along thousands and thousands of downloads a month app downloads um
companies started knocking on our door to say hey we’ve heard about this
technology platform you’ve built is there any chance that could be applied to
the insured members of our insurance company or the rental car customers of
our rental car company and it kind of you know hit us across the head like
that would have been pretty obvious but but we were still we were still
really young we were only a year or so in and really just trying to you know
tighten all the screws on the product itself when this this when when they
started knocking but it also showed us the hunger in the industry for some
alternative to what had existed um previously in that b Tob Toc side of the
industry so um and so we we pursued that and said this would be a much faster
way to growth than going one by one and so while we maintained that B to C
side of our our operations um we really leaned into some of those Business
Development opportunities and one of our first customers was Farmers
Insurance which is are no slouch in the carrier World um quite quite to the
contrary we we regard them as probably the more Innovative um insurance
company out there and and to their credit there was a a gentleman there by
the name of Bobby Massie who um had this Vision that um it could be better
and what I what I see from these guys at honk convinces me that it will be
better and that um we’re going to take a chance on it and they took a
enormous chance for a a company of that size to work with a company as young
and and you know um new to the scene as as honk um was really an
extraordinary move and it changed our trajectory forever because once we did
that and we started delivering we use NPS as a kind of North Star for
customer and client satisfaction and service provider satisfaction um we were
delivering scores in the mid to high 80s on NPS which for anyone familiar
with NPS it’s a it’s a you know Apple I think operates in the 60s and and
they traditionally are world class in terms of their their product line so
it’s it’s very difficult to to get to those levels but we did it and and it
felt so good because when someone puts that kind of faith in you like Bobby
did yeah all you want to do is deliver right just prove to his whole company
yeah he was right people can take chances like that you don’t just have to
buy from IBM as they say right and and and uh and and we rewarded him and
they won awards in that company for the the most Innovative like new product
line um in in their company and so once that happened of course that that
helps then the the other dominoes start to fall and say well farmer Insurance
trust them you know why can’t we and and so it’s just continued from that
point where we’ve been um we mostly grew with with um auto car insurance
carriers and and fleets and now we’re in the mode of of expanding out to Auto
uh auto manufacturers um and rental car companies and and other down Market
um you know people players in the space that could use that elevated level of
service um um because at the end of the day it’s about um Roi and and how do
you connect that you connect it because in a lot of these spaces Insurance
autom manufacturing Etc the the most frequent touch point is a breakdown on
the side of the road if you’re an insurance carrier you’re not contacting
people about their home burning down very often or life insurance and and all
the other products that they offer this is the most frequent touch point so
if you can wow someone 15 minutes 20 minutes arrival time professional
service provider all of a sudden your affinity and your loyalty to Farmers
and you know in the insurance game we all see the ads on TV all the time
people are jumping around all over the place so the whole game is retention
and and that’s what we deliver is we deliver a great experience that that um
that that leads to that those levels of retention that really are economic
Ally meaningful to these these these Enterprises yeah well that’s amazing I
have a couple questions coming out of all of that one is you went from a
consumer based app to working with Farmers what did that look like like now
what what is the interface now yeah it’s you know we the platform the the
foundational elements of the platform were exactly the same it was really
just about exposing apis which are really just you know tunnels into other um
you know interfaces and so for example on the farm within Farmers um in their
app you can just say I I need roadside assistance and all of a sudden it’s
just now plugging in our technology largely unbeknownst so it’s it’s just
embeded it’s embedded in Farmers but it’s honk in the powered by honk powered
byk exactly and and everyone wants to you know maintain their brand message
and we’re very good at at partnering with with companies and and
understanding what their brand message is and delivering that in the in the
way that that we power their their experience okay did that experience then
with Farmers open the floodgates for honk in terms of well if we could do
this with Farmers then we can do this with this provider and this provider
and this tell me about that Evolution it did it did and and we’ve been
growing you know rapidly ever since one of the things though that was super
important to us and I think is different than some of the others that came up
in our industry around the same time is we were all entrepreneurs that came
into this business by the way knowing nothing about Towing and roadside
assistance I didn’t I didn’t hear any of it in your background no and and you
know it it’s um and and so we looked at it from an from an angle that I think
hadn’t been looked at before and and people were doing just silly things in
the industry as one example when we came in they we learned that you know the
background checks that our the incumbents in the industry were doing were
just on the owner of a towing business as opposed to at the individual driver
level and we said why would any insurance company want to partner with that
um that Enterprise when the most important thing is the safety of that person
that end customer that end motorist on the side of the road and we said we’re
going to background check every single driver in our Network we’re going to
pay for it we’re going to put our money where our mouth is we’re going to pay
for it and we’re going to prioritize safety and and so to answer your
question um the floodgates did open because a lot of other Enterprises
started seeing our demo and and also listen to our philosophy about things
like that which was just fundamentally different from the way that others had
incumbents had operated in the industry also you know the network the service
provider Network out there we didn’t think was earning the respect that they
deserve you know it’s one of the it it it is a more dangerous job more more
um tow men and women die each year than firefighters and policemen combined
no so I have no idea it’s a really interesting fact so you know for all of
your listeners out there one of the things I always say and it’s a big theme
in our industry is move over and what that means is that when you see an
emergency vehicle especially tow you know uh trucks on the side of the road
do not pass them in the adjacent Lane you move over as far as humanly
possible because that’s how they lose their lives and so so we again
something we learned early where we said we really want to think about how we
treat our Network pay our Network fairly um promote safety in our Network um
along those lines and so um all of those things kind of helped open the
floodgates and and I think the part the the other um Enterprises in this
industry that are that use utilize this service kind of saw that and it’s
still happening today we we still have lots of work to do there’s still
plenty of um companies out there that aren’t as familiar with honk as as we’d
like them to be but we’re working on that um but we we genuinely feel we have
the the best product in the industry with the most fundamental soundness
around you know how we how we play in this ecosystem in a fair and and
efficient way it it’s interesting you you brought up the I I was going to ask
you about how do you manage the Prof because You’ mentioned it a couple times
the professionalism of the of the driver of the guy driving the tow truck and
and you just talked about that my because I think maybe all of us have this
image yeah of the you know the tow truck driver who’s kind of a little bit of
a rough and tumble loose yeah loose yes very well said yeah and and you know
showing up on the side of the road and and that that may be an unfair
characterization but but you have gone you’ve taken that step and and did you
was that something you because you had some experience that was unsavory or
did you just think wait we have to safety is our Premier goal with our
customer um we never had a bad experience and honestly to this day I hope
there’s something I can knock on here but um you know have not had a major
incident in 10 years of operating and so um I think I think that speaks to
the level of of attention we’ve put on safety and and you know some of these
guys are rough and tumble and some of them probably wear that as a badge of
honor right um but it doesn’t mean they’re not kind or um really professional
or very good at what they do quite honestly the vast vast majority of them
are there are bad apples they will admit there’s bad apples and and those bad
apples give them a bad name and so the the the good providers out there hate
that when when guys give them a bad name because of you know a lack of
professionalism in in one way or another so um but we just do a lot of work
with our our Network and it’s about communicating it’s telling them when
they’re doing things right it’s allowing them to achieve what we call honk hero
status which the the higher your status it’s you know the more you’re going
to get dispatched out to and get preferential you know algorithmic treatment
to get dispatched on a particular piece of ser a particular piece of work um
because we need that safe professional it’s fine if they’re rough and tumble
right there’s nothing wrong with that everyone looks their own way and that’s
okay um but but kindness and professionalism you know are are a necessity and
we work with our Network all the time on that kind of stuff and and by and
large we think we’ve got the best network you know in this industry and and
those NP s numbers that I shared with you they’re partially because we’re
pretty good at our technology but I got to give the credit to them because
they’re the ones who are the touch points with those people and that’s what
matters yeah okay as COO of honk I am curious about how much you r on all of
your experience growing up being in different communities different parts of
the world hockey right obviously being in in Palo Alto do you ever find
yourself like is is were you kind of groomed to be a COO from the beginning
all of those experiences LED you to this or is that part of your personality
or how much do you lean on all of your experience in the in the stuff that
you do today yeah it’s a great question um I think it’s a little of each I
I’d attribute half of it to my personality and half of it to my lived
experiences growing up um because you know combined I’m I’m an I’m an
obsessively organized person you know and to the if my family were listening
they would be chuckling and saying how annoying I probably am but um but but
I am I’m very organized and it and the ability to kind of keep a lot of
things straight and running on the right track at the same time um is
something I feel like I’m I’m pretty good at uh but then there’s that lived
experience as you talked about which um gives that layer of kind of empathy
and ability to maybe lead people and motivate people and direct people in a
way that is not not you know dictatorial or microm managerial but more
collaborative and and servant type leadership um where you know it would be
wrong of us to say to a c to tell a Ser point a finger at a service provider
and say you did this like wrong you know it’s we we take a different approach
it’s it’s more collaborative how can we help you you know how can we give you
information on certain drivers so you as a business owner can make better
decisions things like that so I think by and large a COO or even a CEO I
think those are and then the last piece is also just um being comfortable in
public public speaking presenting selling you know all of those things I’ve
done in in throughout my career and when you kind of match up the empathy and
the kindness that um I think is important with the organization and the
attention to detail tail um with that that public Persona I think it lends
itself well to being in in these kind of positions um and you know it’s it’s
it’s been a fun ride yeah what what are the things that you think you do
really well what do you guys do really well within the walls of Hong there’s
a couple things um the first is um we are data driven to the core and that
that came from um you know Corey and Rick and and me at the beginning
everything was just done based on what the data showed us we have the
expression that opinions are always interesting but irrelevant right uh and
and another expression that we call niito which is nothing interesting
happens inside the office